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[ NNSquad ] Re: ATT tells FCC it wants to ditch land-line services -- let's assist them!

Copper twisted pair has considerable maintenance cost, and it takes up space on the poles they'd rather use for fiber. Face it, the future of networking is fiber and wireless, and the sooner we dump twisted pair, the better off we'll all be.

The building where PAIX is located used to be telco CO. In those days, there was an 8 foot hole in the wall for all the copper to come into and out of the building, but now that it's all fiber-fed, the hole has been all but filled.


[ But of course AT&T has bet the farm -- at least medium term --
on copper for U-verse. A Verizon exec told me (as far as he
was concerned -- not for attribution) that the reasons Verizon
insisted on pulling out the copper when a customer puts in FiOS,
and will never put it back for subsequent persons at the same
premises (except under *extremely* limited circumstances) are:
1) To make sure that all subsequent persons at that address
will be set to go when saturated with triple-play FiOS
advertising and will never have the option of simple
copper POTS


        2)  Indeed, to make sure that government actions down the line
            don't result in that copper being used by a possible

      He didn't seem concerned about the maintenance costs of the copper
      plant, even when I asked him about them.  "What isn't there, can't
      be used," were pretty much the words he used as I recall.  This was
      over a year ago.

      -- Lauren Weinstein
         NNSquad Moderator ]

- - -

On 1/4/2010 6:17 PM, Bob Frankston wrote:
Take as in accept.

Verizon is a simpler case -- if they say it's a liability how much is it
worth? And so what if it's "only" 10Mbps per pair?

-----Original Message-----
From: George Ou [mailto:george_ou@lanarchitect.net]
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 21:08
To: 'Bob Frankston'; 'Dewayne Hendricks'
Cc: nnsquad@nnsquad.org; 'OIA List'; 'Richard Bennett'
Subject: RE: [ NNSquad ] ATT tells FCC it wants to ditch land-line services
-- let's assist them!

Couple of issues.

First of all, when you say "take" that copper plant, you probably mean steal
or pay less for the infrastructure than market rate by forcing the sale.
That should offend any reasonable person as much as the government taking
over individual homes for a public works project of some sort.

Second, copper will probably get to 100 Mbps (64 Mbps is the realistic speed
with channel bonding) as signal processing technology gets better, but that
assumes you're going to spend money building out Fiber to the Node (FTTN)
cabinets to within 1000 meters of each home.  But it's not realistic to
expect that you'll just light it up to 100 Mbps today even with the cabinets
in place.

George Ou

-----Original Message-----
From: nnsquad-bounces+george_ou=lanarchitect.net@nnsquad.org
[mailto:nnsquad-bounces+george_ou=lanarchitect.net@nnsquad.org] On Behalf Of
Bob Frankston
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 3:53 PM
To: 'Dewayne Hendricks'
Cc: nnsquad@nnsquad.org; 'OIA List'
Subject: [ NNSquad ] ATT tells FCC it wants to ditch land-line services --
let's assist them!

ATT is completely correct - they shouldn't be saddled with the cost of
supporting two networks. In fact supporting even one network is a burden for
a company that makes its money selling services. We have done them as great
disservice by requiring they support an infrastructure so that others like
Vonage can simply use the bits without ATT getting the a cut of the service
revenue they need to fund the infrastructure based a business model that
dates back to 19th century telegraph.

I say we heed their plea and immediately offer them assistance along with
forgiveness for past failures. If they are so foolishness as to want to hang
on to their fiber then let them.

We should immediately take all that copper off their hands and hand it over
to the communities. The communities are then free to use modern electronics
to "light" those wires up to 10 to 100Mbps at retail modem prices
(<$100/line). That was part of my original plan for home networking and we
have over 20 years of Moore's law improvement to catch up on. And since
we're dealing with bits and not billing we can be very creative in what we
do and we can ignore the artificial distinction between wired and wireless
bits. Or, for that matter between fiber and copper bits.

The problem is that ATT is right - we don't need redundant infrastructures
and the paid-for copper trumps debt-creating fiber. They have tied their
fate to the latter. How long can they kite debt?

So lets' take ATT up on its offer. Sure it's assisted suicide but then
sacrificing companies for the greater good is the very essence of capitalism
and the idea of limited liability. Anyway ATT already died - we're just
talking about the ghost of ATT's past.

[ Bob, somehow I suspect that the U-verse folks won't be enthusiastic about your proposal, especially after planting all those VRADs and dragging fiber out to them to "remonetize" that (often monopoly-era) copper and other handy physical plant goodies. Of course if AT&T hadn't had such largely Ma Bell-era facilities already in place, the cost of deploying U-verse, particularly in areas that would have involved digging up untold thousands of streets and yards, would have been monumentally higher than it has been.

      Telecom Monopoly Status:
      The Gift From the Government that Keeps on Giving, Even
      When You're Not Officially a Monopoly Any More!

      -- Lauren Weinstein
         NNSquad Moderator ]

-----Original Message-----
From: dewayne-net [mailto:dewayne-net@warpspeed.com] On Behalf Of Dewayne
Sent: Monday, January 04, 2010 15:26
To: Dewayne-Net Technology List
Subject: [Dewayne-Net] ATT tells FCC it wants to ditch land-line services

ATT tells FCC it wants to ditch land-line services


By Michelle Maisto

AT&T tells the FCC that in order to meet Congress' goal of extending
broadband access to 100 percent of Americans, it needs to heave the old
land-line business off its shoulders so it can focus funds on broadband and
IP-based communications.

AT&T has told the Federal Communications Commission that in order to meet
Congress' goal of extending broadband access to 100 percent of Americans, it
needs to ditch its land-line business in favor of focusing on broadband and
IP-based communications.

itch-LandLine-Services/>RSS Feed:<http://www.warpspeed.com/wordpress>

-- Richard Bennett Research Fellow Information Technology and Innovation Foundation Washington, DC